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PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 7:25 pm 
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Hi Everyone
I'm new here, and it has been a while since I've looked at student flutes. Would you tell me what intermediate brands ($1500-$2800) you recommend, and why, if possible? Things like style of embouchure cut, mechanism, etc. etc. is all good info.
Hope I'm not repeating someone else's recent post.
Thanks very much.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 8:23 pm 
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Where in the world are you?

I was very lucky - when I was shopping for my flute, London, UK was only about 2 hours train ride. I went to a specialist flute shop, who helped my try our loads of different flutes in my price range.

I ended up with something very different to what I had "planned" to buy ... I got a cheaper flute (yamaha 271), with an Altus headjoint. Took about 2 hours of trying all their flutes, playing then, trying another .... going back to compare etc but nearly 10 years later I still have it and play it daily.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 9:21 pm 
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Hi

Thanks for your response. I live in the USA, am a professional flutist, and when researching on behalf of a student, noticed that a number of flute brands had been born, died, or mysteriously morphed under a new name. I know all the top of the line flutes very well, but only some student flutes, and they change so fast that I frankly have not kept up. I'm fairly confident of the quality of the little sibling flutes of the major flute companies eg. Sonare is a cheaper sibling of Powell. But the rest....in any case I don't want to dismiss anything out of hand. I figured an internet site would yield a good variety of responses, rather than relying on my friends.

I'm interested in knowing what flute to avoid, particularly from a flute technician's point of view. Or conversely, which ones they love. I'm not against my student mixing and matching head joints and bodies either. But researching ahead like this will save him postage as he doesn't live near a major city.
Thanks!


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 10:43 pm 
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In that price range you're generally looking at:

Amadeus
Avanti
Azumi
Dean Yang
Di Zhao
Jupiter DiMedici
Lyric
Pearl
Sonare
Trevor James
Yamaha

There are other brands out there, but these are the most solid in construction and give you the most bang for your buck.

_________________
Repair blog: http://www.aclassicaljourney.blogspot.com
"FEAR has two meanings. 1: Forget Everything And Run or 2: Face Everything And Rise. The choice is yours."
"You're only given a little spark of madness. You mustn't lose it."


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2012 11:41 pm 
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Thanks much.

Some of those are the usual suspects, though I've not played Azumi, Amadeus, Avanti, Di Zhao, Lyric, Dean Yang.

BTW has anyone ever dealt with Briolette flutes (not pics)? I know the company died, and there's no info online. And that they're Chinese...


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2012 4:55 pm 
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archflutista wrote:
Thanks much.

Some of those are the usual suspects, though I've not played Azumi, Amadeus, Avanti, Di Zhao, Lyric, Dean Yang.

BTW has anyone ever dealt with Briolette flutes (not pics)? I know the company died, and there's no info online. And that they're Chinese...


If you looking for a reliable, well constructed flute which will not become a technician's nightmare, then I must recommend in the following order:

1) Yamaha 371H, 471H (however some are saying for the price just get the 271 and upgrade a good headjoint as you progress which is not a bad strategy for economy) - student yams are built like a tank, economical to service as you do not need to make multiple side trips every so often for adjustment which some other brands on your list does. http://www.jennifercluff.com Own a 371 ($770 MINT fr ebay last year) and am loving it more and more. Great value.
2) Jupiter step up or intermediate - have heard great things about this. Great value. Affiliated to Altus. Great sounding. Not sure about maintenance.
3) Altus 807,907 ($1050-1500) Miyazawa 202 ($1400-1700) or Muramatsu EXIII ($2200) - these you can get quality secondhand ones well within your budget from reputable resellers - I got my Altus and Miyazawa from ebay (shock n horror!) but they came MINT and after some embouchure adjustment, what a dream to play. The only qualifier is that in Australia, these babies need to be serviced by special technicians and they charge an arm and a leg for their annual service. But properly adjusted they put you in good stead to go the distance with simple headjoint upgrade. Superior construct and what a pleasure to play. For secondhand go no more than 3 years old. (Lyric is an entry level Miyazawa)

Rave reveiws about the Azumi 3000 which comes with the bells and whistles of an advanced flute. You can buy one new just within your budget. Tone is reportedly beautiful but not sure about durability and maintenance needs.

During my purchasing process I had also read on the internet about some horror stories of how fragile some of the brands you've listed are and parent's having to make multiple trips to the technician for constant adjustments. These would be the student models and users would be careless kids. However these comments were from a few years ago and may not apply anymore. Google for comments on Trevor James and Pearl. There was a blog by a technician himself but I can't find it. Will post link if I find it.

Forgive me for getting ahead of myself (above). But I am currently intrigued by the Guo flutes, if you are open minded enough, seriously consider one. Even professionals use their mid to high end and are raving about it.
So - if you are brave enough, get the GUO New Voice. As Giant Bike's has somewhat become the Trek/Cannondale of the east, perhaps the GUO will become the Powell/Abell of the future. Mellow colors and tone. LIGHTWEIGHT (for the v young or v old) Ease all registers. Easy maintenance, wash and wipe or simply wipe down. No need to oil (as in wooden flutes) nor worry about temperature fluctuations which could affect flute mechanisms even the metal ones. I hear that the Guo keys are unlikely to wear out and maintenance is mininum. Ticks all boxes for me. Tonal colours easily coaxed. Lightweight, portable Waterproof.

Grenadite Original (<$2000) plays like a reputable wooden flute - maybe even better. Suits baroque, celtic musos
Grenadite II ($2300-2800) just out and headjoint cut is handfinished for even better tonal properties
New Voice ($1000) - big, rich and mellow tones not as woody a tad brighter - rave reviews from virtually everyone, jazz and baroque
Tocco ($600-700) - wow for the price but take a listen ... Riccardo Ghiani and Silvia Careddu plays TOCCO flute by GUO during Masterclass @ Bosa (OR) in Sardinia on July.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ym73vdVo ... e=youtu.be
And FruitCakeJam, S'pore with a bit of mando-pop =D (my new discovery)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPdctead ... re=related Gotta love these guys.

Kudos to Guo who knows the market. In our current economic climate plus penchant for travel, I will not be surprised if the Guos become the more popular alternative to the masses as they give alot of bang for their buck. The ecclectic of course will always stick to their favourie boutique brands. But most of us are a little bit of BOTH =D

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Last edited by flutego12 on Sun Sep 30, 2012 5:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2012 1:12 am 
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Thanks so much for your detailed response. Will take a look at some of these at the next Flute Fair.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 24, 2012 10:42 am 
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I am also looking for a flute within the said budget. For economical reasons, I plan to have a Japanese YFL-271 myself (the Japanese model is known for its durability and the color wont tarnish as much a the Indonesian made one), and upgrade the headjoint to either the K-Cut or the EC one. Still not sure whether they will fit my yfl-271 as these two headjoints are made for higher-end series (500s)

zummerzet_lou wrote:
I got a cheaper flute (yamaha 271), with an Altus headjoint. Took about 2 hours of trying all their flutes, playing then, trying another .... going back to compare etc but nearly 10 years later I still have it and play it daily.


How is that possible? Did you do any fitting to get the Altus headjoint working with the Yamaha body?

(Forgive my abysmal English, I come from a country where English is a foreign language (EFL))


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2012 6:13 pm 
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Nashi-nashi (Ari?)

Your English is good enough that probably no one here would have thought you weren't a native speaker.

From your handle name I was going to say "Japan" .....


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 30, 2012 10:25 am 
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"Altus 807,907 ($1050-1500) Miyazawa 202 ($1400-1700) or Muramatsu EXIII ($2200)"

Flutego12:

In what world do these flutes cost so little? An Altus 807 STARTS at $3K, a Miyazawa 202 at $4k, and a Muramatsu EX at $3900. The only time I've seen prices even approach the ones you mention are used on Ebay or from Matthews Music (a wide majority of which are not up to US standards, are pitched at 445 and/or aren't necessarily authentic).

It concerns me that you are genuinely (but perhaps not intentionally) recommending machine/mass produced student flutes that do not have the same levels of playability over handmade/entry level 'professional' flutes. When put in a lineup, the higher end models you listed last win every time in every regard. I don't mean any of this as an attack of any sort but rather it worries me that perhaps we might be setting up unrealistic expectations.

_________________
Repair blog: http://www.aclassicaljourney.blogspot.com
"FEAR has two meanings. 1: Forget Everything And Run or 2: Face Everything And Rise. The choice is yours."
"You're only given a little spark of madness. You mustn't lose it."


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 31, 2012 12:44 am 
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fluteguy18 wrote:
"Altus 807,907 ($1050-1500) Miyazawa 202 ($1400-1700) or Muramatsu EXIII ($2200)"

Flutego12:

In what world do these flutes cost so little? An Altus 807 STARTS at $3K, a Miyazawa 202 at $4k, and a Muramatsu EX at $3900. The only time I've seen prices even approach the ones you mention are used on Ebay or from Matthews Music (a wide majority of which are not up to US standards, are pitched at 445 and/or aren't necessarily authentic).

It concerns me that you are genuinely (but perhaps not intentionally) recommending machine/mass produced student flutes that do not have the same levels of playability over handmade/entry level 'professional' flutes. When put in a lineup, the higher end models you listed last win every time in every regard. I don't mean any of this as an attack of any sort but rather it worries me that perhaps we might be setting up unrealistic expectations.


Hi Fluteguy18
That's ok and tis good to air any questions or concerns you may have for clarification. Constructive comments are always welcome.
The order of recommend was given in response to his original request for (I believe the words used were) "student and intermediate within the said price range" - didn't see a request for semi professional handmade flutes hence, started from lower end to higher end. I placed the 3rd category last because they were used prices and not everyone is predisposed to buying used - as new these are outside his price range.

I believe I did qualify these as USED flute prices. I had spoke from my own purchasing experience - as I could not decide on which flute to get, and these were available, so I ended up getting a Yamaha 371H Allegro for $770 (y.o.m. 2009), Miyazawa PA202 (C,C,E) for $1.6k (y.o.m. 2006) bought Aug & Sep 2011, AND RECENTLY an Altus 807E (C,C,E) for $1.6k (y.o.m. 2009). [USD] So far I've been blessed and love them all. Now it's hard deciding which to let go. My teacher couldn't believe the deals I got for the first two and said never to let the Miyazawa go. She hasn't seen the Altus yet.

Note however, I did purchase the Yamaha 371 FIRST as its an intermediate student flute and I am very happy with it esp for Jethro Tulls Bouree and Hromek's Celtic Guitar music genres.
It was the choice intermediate flute however, I could not resist what all the ho0-hah was about these hand-cut semipros and got the subsequent two to experience for myself. Did not have much to lose as new in Australia the 202 (B foot Open hole) was over $4k and that was after discount. The new prices have since adjusted a little. If I were able, I would have happily supported the local retailer however the difference was too much for me to swallow atm. I have also seen several EXIII CCE listed for USD2.2k from the same US seller.

Having said that my ebay purchases were leaps of faith and I was blessed. If you can, trial the headjoint before you buy for a fit to your embouchure.

Anyhow it was good of you to clarify.

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flutist with a screwdriver


Last edited by flutego12 on Fri Jan 25, 2013 11:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2013 9:57 pm 
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fluteguy18 wrote:
"Altus 807,907 ($1050-1500) Miyazawa 202 ($1400-1700) or Muramatsu EXIII ($2200)"

Flutego12:

In what world do these flutes cost so little? An Altus 807 STARTS at $3K, a Miyazawa 202 at $4k, and a Muramatsu EX at $3900. The only time I've seen prices even approach the ones you mention are used on Ebay or from Matthews Music (a wide majority of which are not up to US standards, are pitched at 445 and/or aren't necessarily authentic).

It concerns me that you are genuinely (but perhaps not intentionally) recommending machine/mass produced student flutes that do not have the same levels of playability over handmade/entry level 'professional' flutes. When put in a lineup, the higher end models you listed last win every time in every regard. I don't mean any of this as an attack of any sort but rather it worries me that perhaps we might be setting up unrealistic expectations.


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