Hi, everyone.
I'm a saxophonist trying to pick up the flute. Love it, so far.
I am perplexed by a technical problem, though. For some reason (maybe my daughter dropped the flute, I don't know), the middle G note no longer plays. When I blow on it, I get an airy, week, sound, barely audible.
It is frustrating, since the G key is a very simple tone hole (2 in fact) and I have not been able to trace the root of it. Strangely enough, the G# works fine.
I am a bit short of $ right now and would hate to spend $60 just to have the repair man look at my flute and fix it in 2 sec's. Am I missing something here? Any suggestions?
Many, many thanks in advance.
L
Help with the G key
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fluteguy18
- Posts: 2311
- Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2006 3:11 pm
Thanks, Fluteland.
I considered that as well, but I made sure there was no air escaping from the G key (even as far as pressing the G key and its adjacent with my right hand) and the sound was still not there.
Besides, if there was something bent with the G key, the G# would not work (it uses the same keys, except that it opens an extra key hole in the back).
Any suggestions?
Many thanks,
I considered that as well, but I made sure there was no air escaping from the G key (even as far as pressing the G key and its adjacent with my right hand) and the sound was still not there.
Besides, if there was something bent with the G key, the G# would not work (it uses the same keys, except that it opens an extra key hole in the back).
Any suggestions?
Many thanks,
I'm by no means an expert, but it seems very unintuitive to my mind that you shouldn't be able to play G, but can play G#..or F, E etc...other notes that require the G tone holes to be sealed. That said, I do believe there is a real problem, considering G shouldn't be a particularly difficult note to produce, and you say the flute is otherwise working properly. I would definitely consider having a tech check it out...or maybe there's someone here who knows more than I do (not saying much) who can give you a better idea of what's wrong. Good luck!
"There was never a bad peace or a good war" -Benjamin Franklin
"Those who dream by day are aware of much which escapes those who dream only by night." -Edgar Allen Poe
"Those who dream by day are aware of much which escapes those who dream only by night." -Edgar Allen Poe
If no air is escaping when you are holding both keys down separately, then I'd agree, a pad problem is unlikely. More likely, it's an adjustment problem. 99.9% of flutes are closed g sharp and this means the g and g sharp keys are linked. It could be that the g key isn't closing fully even though the linked g sharp key is. You should be able to sort this out by turning the adjustment screw on the g key with a fine screwdriver. If the flute has a split E mechanism (a lot of student flutes do, these days), then that adds further complications, as what the mechanism does is decouple the g and g sharp keys when the E key is pressed down so that the g sharp key is then closed for top E which is a difficult note to produce without the Gsharp key being closed (in Boehm's original design, the G sharp key was open and was fingered for top E, but for various reasons there was a move over to closed g sharp prompted by French flautists who were familiar with that layout from pre-Boehm flutes). In othere words, if there is a split E mechanism, you may also need to adjust the screw under the mechanism. It will involve a lot of trial and error - the adjustments are very small - usually less than a quarter turn either way with the screwdriver. If this doesn't work, then I'm lost! Kind regards, T.
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fluteguy18
- Posts: 2311
- Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2006 3:11 pm
The G and G# keys are not linked. When you take a flute apart, they are not connected whatsoever in a closed g# flute (which is the current standard).
I said a pad is leaking or a key is bent. It probably is. There is nothing overtly mechanical with the G keys and G# key. Make sure the g# pad on the back isn't leaking. Just because you can't see a leak doesn't mean it isn't there. It could be on the back side of the key and you can't see it. It happens all the time. Especially if the key is bent, you probably can't see it.
And YES the lower G key can be bent and the G# still work. The lower G tonehole and the tonehole on the back of the flute that opens when you press down the G# lever are parallel. To get the G# to sound, the above toneholes have to be sealing, and either of the toneholes (lower G or back G#) have to venting. It's very simple.
Take it in. This is not a quick fix sort of thing. Unless you've had training in flute repair (like myself for example), you won't be able to fix this on your own. The only way that you could fix this yourself without training is if (as previously suggested) there is a split e mechanism on the flute, and the adjustment screw between the upper and lower G keys needs tightened.
It could also be that the back G# key isn't sealing properly because the spring that holds it closed is weak. If this is the case, the flute will need to be disassembled, and the spring replaced (which is a job for a repairman).
Trust me on this. Flute repair is a hobby of mine.
I said a pad is leaking or a key is bent. It probably is. There is nothing overtly mechanical with the G keys and G# key. Make sure the g# pad on the back isn't leaking. Just because you can't see a leak doesn't mean it isn't there. It could be on the back side of the key and you can't see it. It happens all the time. Especially if the key is bent, you probably can't see it.
And YES the lower G key can be bent and the G# still work. The lower G tonehole and the tonehole on the back of the flute that opens when you press down the G# lever are parallel. To get the G# to sound, the above toneholes have to be sealing, and either of the toneholes (lower G or back G#) have to venting. It's very simple.
Take it in. This is not a quick fix sort of thing. Unless you've had training in flute repair (like myself for example), you won't be able to fix this on your own. The only way that you could fix this yourself without training is if (as previously suggested) there is a split e mechanism on the flute, and the adjustment screw between the upper and lower G keys needs tightened.
It could also be that the back G# key isn't sealing properly because the spring that holds it closed is weak. If this is the case, the flute will need to be disassembled, and the spring replaced (which is a job for a repairman).
Trust me on this. Flute repair is a hobby of mine.
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fluttiegurl
- Posts: 882
- Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 11:05 pm
When you finger G, two keys go down, the g sharp key under the third finger of your left hand and the adjacent key, which is the G key. They are linke (except if there is a split E mechanism)! G sharp is produced by the duplicate key behind, operated by the lever. In Boehm's original system, there was no duplicate key, the G and G sharp keys weren't joined, G sharp was the same fingering as for G on the usual system today, and you then pressed down the lever with your left hand little finger to produce G. What you are saying is only correct on closed G sharp flutes with a split E mechanism, which is basically a declutching device. Another thing is that this gentleman said he didn't want to go to the expense of going to a repair shop and I think it could be worth his while trying out the adjustment keys, and provided he makes only small turns there shouldn't be a problem. I was doing that sort of simple adjustment at the age of twelve..fluteguy18 wrote:The G and G# keys are not linked. When you take a flute apart, they are not connected whatsoever in a closed g# flute (which is the current standard).
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fluteguy18
- Posts: 2311
- Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2006 3:11 pm
Okay. Obviously this is a miscommunication by means of geographic region. You are in the UK, and I am in the USA. What you are calling the G# key is what I am calling the upper G key. I was saying that the two G keys (which you are saying are linked) and the G# lever are not linked.
What YOU are saying is only possible with a split E mechanism. If there is NO split e mechanism, the upper G key (in your words the "g#" key) and the lower g key are connected by a single solid hinge tube. With a split e mechanism, this hinge tube is split into two separate tubes, and there are connecting levers (also called adjusting tabs) that are adjusted by either screws or shims. In the photo below, it is called the 'G link.' If the OP does NOT have a split e mechanism, (which the split e mech. is fairly uncommon on standard student flutes in the USA), there won't be any adjusting tabs to turn screws in.
Now, unless you are to adjust the other screws on the other keys (A, A# etc), he could try that, but it wouldn't be beneficial. The problem obviously lies in the three keys we are discussing because the notes above G sound fine. The upper G/G# key, G key/lower G key, and the G# lever are the problem.
http://www.shwoodwind.co.uk/Glossary/Im ... plit_E.jpg
So, to make it simple. If there is a split E mechanism, try adjusting the screw in the "G Link." If there is not split E mechanism, there is no "G link" so there will be no screw to turn. If there is a screw to turn, and it doesn't work, take it in to be worked on. This is not a quick fix kind of problem.
What YOU are saying is only possible with a split E mechanism. If there is NO split e mechanism, the upper G key (in your words the "g#" key) and the lower g key are connected by a single solid hinge tube. With a split e mechanism, this hinge tube is split into two separate tubes, and there are connecting levers (also called adjusting tabs) that are adjusted by either screws or shims. In the photo below, it is called the 'G link.' If the OP does NOT have a split e mechanism, (which the split e mech. is fairly uncommon on standard student flutes in the USA), there won't be any adjusting tabs to turn screws in.
Now, unless you are to adjust the other screws on the other keys (A, A# etc), he could try that, but it wouldn't be beneficial. The problem obviously lies in the three keys we are discussing because the notes above G sound fine. The upper G/G# key, G key/lower G key, and the G# lever are the problem.
http://www.shwoodwind.co.uk/Glossary/Im ... plit_E.jpg
So, to make it simple. If there is a split E mechanism, try adjusting the screw in the "G Link." If there is not split E mechanism, there is no "G link" so there will be no screw to turn. If there is a screw to turn, and it doesn't work, take it in to be worked on. This is not a quick fix kind of problem.
Last edited by fluteguy18 on Wed Aug 05, 2009 9:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
Agreed! We are speaking the same language after all! I think this might have been a case of the old expression about being 'divided by a common language'!fluteguy18 wrote:Okay. Obviously this is a miscommunication by means of geographic region. You are in the UK, and I am in the USA. What you are calling the G# key is what I am calling the upper G key. I was saying that the two G keys (which you are saying are linked) and the G# lever are not linked.
So, to make it simple. If there is a split E mechanism, try adjusting the screw in the "G Link." If there is not split E mechanism, there is no "G link" so there will be no screw to turn. If there is a screw to turn, and it doesn't work, take it in to be worked on. This is not a quick fix kind of problem.
